I hope to place a PC running Etch in our small (tiny, actually)
airport building for use by pilots. The PC will be used to access
perhaps 10 web sites (plus or minus) over a DSL connection and to run
a few utilities to show GMT and a calculator and maybe a few
additional applications. The box will also serve as a real-time data
collection platform and web server for a local weather observing
system, so I want to prevent it from being re-booted.

I hope to make the PC reasonably idiot proof (the box will be kept
separate from the users) - the keyboard and display will be
accessible. The goal is to keep users from inadvertently trashing the
machine, but to provide usability.

Should I run a GUI (currently Gnome is installed)? How do I restrict
access to functions that users shouldn't access?

Is there a way to run a menu system, without using a Gnome...perhaps
another window manager?

Thanks, all
Dave W.


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org

On 8/5/07, Dave Walker <carol.dave.walker@gmail.com> wrote:
> I hope to make the PC reasonably idiot proof (the box will be kept
> separate from the users) - the keyboard and display will be
> accessible. The goal is to keep users from inadvertently trashing the
> machine, but to provide usability.

Sabayon provides the ability to lock down GNOME and any GNOME app, in
addition to Firefox, and Openoffice.org. Also, you can restrict access
to certain features by setting some GConf keys. I believe GNOME has a
system administrator's guide which details exactly what is possible
and what their recommendations are.

--
Andrew Barr

We matter more than pounds and pence,
your economic theory makes no sense...


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org

On 8/5/07, Dave Walker <carol.dave.walker@gmail.com> wrote:
> I hope to make the PC reasonably idiot proof (the box will be kept
> separate from the users) - the keyboard and display will be
> accessible. The goal is to keep users from inadvertently trashing the
> machine, but to provide usability.

Sabayon provides the ability to lock down GNOME and any GNOME app, in
addition to Firefox, and Openoffice.org. Also, you can restrict access
to certain features by setting some GConf keys. I believe GNOME has a
system administrator's guide which details exactly what is possible
and what their recommendations are.

--
Andrew Barr

We matter more than pounds and pence,
your economic theory makes no sense...


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org

On Sun, Aug 05, 2007 at 03:06:10PM -0500, Dave Walker wrote:
> I hope to place a PC running Etch in our small (tiny, actually)
> airport building for use by pilots. The PC will be used to access
> perhaps 10 web sites (plus or minus) over a DSL connection and to run
> a few utilities to show GMT and a calculator and maybe a few
> additional applications. The box will also serve as a real-time data
> collection platform and web server for a local weather observing
> system, so I want to prevent it from being re-booted.
>

Be very careful. These are two very different applications to put on
one box. You don't want the weather reports to stop going out if the
desktop freezes the box. A box that runs X, is almost by definition
more prone to needing to reboot than one that doesn't. Ditto if you use
a Desktop environment instead of a simple window manager.

If you really need it to be one box, here's what I would suggest:

Set up the server stuff first.

Setup a chroot for the desktop stuff, one that gets copied when used.

Use the pam module so that when the desktop user logs in, they get a
fresh clean chroot which gets distroyed when the user logs out.

Use icewm with the toolbar configured with the common tools. Also note
that Xfce seems to use more and more memory; I don't know if it has been
fixed.

Determine if you need a full-fledged web browser for those 10 sites or
if something like links2 or dillo will work. Hint: dillo is plain with
a gtk interface, links2 adds javascript but doesn't have a gtk
interface, whereas for flash you need a full browser like iceweasel or
Konqueror.

Provide an alternate means for an administrator to log into the machine;
ssh or serial console (or both). You may want to setup syslog to send
logs to another machine and put something on that machine to monitor the
logs.

Good luck,

Doug.


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org

On Sun, 05 Aug 2007 22:10:09 +0200, Dave Walker wrote:

-- snip

> I hope to make the PC reasonably idiot proof (the box will be kept
> separate from the users) - the keyboard and display will be
> accessible. The goal is to keep users from inadvertently trashing the
> machine, but to provide usability.
>
> Should I run a GUI (currently Gnome is installed)? How do I restrict
> access to functions that users shouldn't access?
>
> Is there a way to run a menu system, without using a Gnome...perhaps
> another window manager?
>
> Thanks, all
> Dave W.

Have you considered the KDE "Kiosk-Mode"? Check out this article from
Linux Journal - maybe it will have what you're after:

http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7718

Sincerely,

~A~

--
Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- Anonymous
================================
Registered Linux User No. 306834

On Sun, 05 Aug 2007 22:10:09 +0200, Dave Walker wrote:

-- snip

> I hope to make the PC reasonably idiot proof (the box will be kept
> separate from the users) - the keyboard and display will be
> accessible. The goal is to keep users from inadvertently trashing the
> machine, but to provide usability.
>
> Should I run a GUI (currently Gnome is installed)? How do I restrict
> access to functions that users shouldn't access?
>
> Is there a way to run a menu system, without using a Gnome...perhaps
> another window manager?
>
> Thanks, all
> Dave W.

Have you considered the KDE "Kiosk-Mode"? Check out this article from
Linux Journal - maybe it will have what you're after:

http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7718

Sincerely,

~A~

--
Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- Anonymous
================================
Registered Linux User No. 306834

On Sun, Aug 05, 2007 at 08:58:30PM -0400, Douglas Allan Tutty wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 05, 2007 at 03:06:10PM -0500, Dave Walker wrote:
> > I hope to place a PC running Etch in our small (tiny, actually)
> > airport building for use by pilots. The PC will be used to access
> > perhaps 10 web sites (plus or minus) over a DSL connection and to run
> > a few utilities to show GMT and a calculator and maybe a few
> > additional applications. The box will also serve as a real-time data
> > collection platform and web server for a local weather observing
> > system, so I want to prevent it from being re-booted.
> >
>
> Be very careful. These are two very different applications to put on
> one box. You don't want the weather reports to stop going out if the
> desktop freezes the box. A box that runs X, is almost by definition
> more prone to needing to reboot than one that doesn't. Ditto if you use
> a Desktop environment instead of a simple window manager.
>
> If you really need it to be one box, here's what I would suggest:
>
> Set up the server stuff first.
>
> Setup a chroot for the desktop stuff, one that gets copied when used.

maybe this is a good use for xen. Run the desktop stuff, whatever you
decide in a xen dom-u to segregate it from the main server.

A

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQFGt0R4aIeIEqwil4YRAhOBAJ9Kfixxlrd5cfKCwXneZR ZifQEUPgCeJ/Ob
2iw00idC4gr4ml7vGvQBbog=
=tJf5
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

On Sun, Aug 05, 2007 at 03:06:10PM -0500, Dave Walker wrote:
> I hope to place a PC running Etch in our small (tiny, actually)
> airport building for use by pilots. The PC will be used to access
> perhaps 10 web sites (plus or minus) over a DSL connection and to run
> a few utilities to show GMT and a calculator and maybe a few
> additional applications. The box will also serve as a real-time data
> collection platform and web server for a local weather observing
> system, so I want to prevent it from being re-booted.
>
> I hope to make the PC reasonably idiot proof (the box will be kept
> separate from the users) - the keyboard and display will be
> accessible. The goal is to keep users from inadvertently trashing the
> machine, but to provide usability.
>
> Should I run a GUI (currently Gnome is installed)? How do I restrict
> access to functions that users shouldn't access?
>
> Is there a way to run a menu system, without using a Gnome...perhaps
> another window manager?
>
> Thanks, all
> Dave W.
The basics include: remove all packages that are not needed including
services(daemons). Disable access to the console in the xorg.conf (the
ctrl-alt-f1). Use stable releases. Get a 'test user' to try and do
stupid things to make it crash.
If I understand you, the users will not need 'local' applications
(solitaire, word processor, games, etc.) but ONLY a web browser. As the
web browser will be the interface to some web server application that
does all this stuff like : calculate gmt, records data, etc. In that
case, all you need is a web browser and its reverse dependencies. Then
you can create an x session just containing the web browser, making it
the only thing on the screen.
=K
--
| .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux == | my web site: |
| : :' : The Universal |mysite.verizon.net/kevin.mark/|
| `. `' Operating System | go to counter.li.org and |
| `- http://www.debian.org/ | be counted! #238656 |
| my keyserver: subkeys.pgp.net | my NPO: cfsg.org |
|join the new debian-community.org to Debian! |
|_______ Unless I ask to be CCd, assume I am subscribed _______|


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org

Dave Walker wrote:
> I hope to place a PC running Etch in our small (tiny, actually)
> airport building for use by pilots. The PC will be used to access
> perhaps 10 web sites (plus or minus) over a DSL connection and to run
> a few utilities to show GMT and a calculator and maybe a few
> additional applications. The box will also serve as a real-time data
> collection platform and web server for a local weather observing
> system, so I want to prevent it from being re-booted.

Don't do this. The server and the web browser need to be separate
machines. The "accessible" machine could be one using a LiveCD
you specially spin with limited apps on it, and which auto boots
into a browser. DSL (Damn Small Linux) should be adaptable to this.
It uses a "busy box" style display manager with limited apps loaded
up.

Critical apps are incompatible with users fooling around with
stuff.

Mike
--
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){pri ntf(p,34,p,34);}
Oppose globalization and One World Governments like the UN.
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org