I have a small, validated page that uses "bgcolor" in
<body... and several <td... 's
The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox.

http://frontal-lobe.info/link2pdf.html

I've been away from html for the last year and am re-learning it.

Any ideas? Thanks,

Mason C

Scripsit Mason C:

> I have a small, validated page that uses "bgcolor" in
> <body... and several <td... 's
> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox.
>
> http://frontal-lobe.info/link2pdf.html

Which difference(s) you are referring to? Both Opera and IE 7 show the
background colors. There's a difference: on Opera, there is a white
stripe, resulting from an empty cell, whereas IE 7 ignores it. If this
is the problem, you just need to decide: remove the cell or put
non-blank content, such as &nbsp;, into it (if you want it to appear for
some odd reason).

> I've been away from html for the last year and am re-learning it.

Then start afresh. Read a good tutorial on basics of HTML, and never
re-learn the ugly presentational side of the language; instead, learn
basic CSS from a good tutorial.

How come a page doesn't fit into my browser window (it's almost half of
my screen!), despite not containing any relevant information but a link
to a PDF file? You're trying too much. But if you want to create boxes
with background colors, use just heading or <div> elements (as
appropriate) and background properties in CSS. Using bgcolor in HTML
isn't among the top ten sins, but neither is among the top 100 things
you should learn about HTML, and the CSS counterparts are much more
flexible and powerful.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

On Sun, 4 May 2008 09:11:55 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi>
wrote:

>Scripsit Mason C:
>
>> I have a small, validated page that uses "bgcolor" in
>> <body... and several <td... 's
>> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox.
>>
>> http://frontal-lobe.info/link2pdf.html
>
>Which difference(s) you are referring to? Both Opera and IE 7 show the
>background colors. There's a difference: on Opera, there is a white
>stripe, resulting from an empty cell, whereas IE 7 ignores it. If this
>is the problem, you just need to decide: remove the cell or put
>non-blank content, such as &nbsp;, into it (if you want it to appear for
>some odd reason).
>
>> I've been away from html for the last year and am re-learning it.
>
>Then start afresh. Read a good tutorial on basics of HTML, and never
>re-learn the ugly presentational side of the language; instead, learn
>basic CSS from a good tutorial.
>
>How come a page doesn't fit into my browser window (it's almost half of
>my screen!), despite not containing any relevant information but a link
>to a PDF file? You're trying too much. But if you want to create boxes
>with background colors, use just heading or <div> elements (as
>appropriate) and background properties in CSS. Using bgcolor in HTML
>isn't among the top ten sins, but neither is among the top 100 things
>you should learn about HTML, and the CSS counterparts are much more
>flexible and powerful.

Jukka, I appreciate your comments. I use CSS but for that little page
I was in a hurry and used bgcolor. I validated the page. The color
doesn't show in MSIE or Firefox. Why?

The link page is there because I am concerned that the logging engines
and search robots may not log a pdf page -- that's another thing I need to
learn about. ( I'm going through web life change forced by being kicked
off Earthlink for excess traffic..)

But in the meantime I'm puzzled by the unexpected color failure.

Mason C

Scripsit Mason C:

> On Sun, 4 May 2008 09:11:55 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela"
> <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> wrote:
- -
>> Which difference(s) you are referring to? Both Opera and IE 7 show
>> the background colors. There's a difference: on Opera, there is a
>> white stripe, resulting from an empty cell, whereas IE 7 ignores it.

Did you actually read even that part of my message, or did you just
quote everything without reading anything?

> The color doesn't show in MSIE or Firefox.

Which color?

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

On Sat, 03 May 2008 22:38:50 -0700, Mason C wrote:
> I have a small, validated page that uses "bgcolor" in
><body... and several <td... 's
> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox.
>
> http://frontal-lobe.info/link2pdf.html

Looks the same with Opera 9.27 and Firefox 2.0 under Linux.

--
Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry ncherry@linuxha.com
http://www.linuxha.com/ Main site
http://linuxha.blogspot.com/ My HA Blog
Author of: Linux Smart Homes For Dummies

On Mon, 05 May 2008 08:53:54 +1000, dorayme <doraymeRidThis@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:

>In article <piiq141v482e34vauqbf89btkqb91qvf0i@4ax.com>,
> Mason C <masoncXXX@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote:
>
>> I have a small, validated page that uses "bgcolor" in
>> <body... and several <td... 's
>> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox.
>>
>> http://frontal-lobe.info/link2pdf.html
>>
>> I've been away from html for the last year and am re-learning it.
>>
>> Any ideas? Thanks,
>>
>> Mason C
>
>What colours? Why have you got a row and cell with nothing in it but a
>white bg at the top?

Design choice -- to give some space at the top.

The question was:

The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox. Why?

I'm beginning to suspect I'm asking in the wrong group.

Mason C

Mason C <masoncXXX@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote in
news:t66t14d69q1us7k3g3t4obec7d49f5fe0q@4ax.com:

> On Mon, 05 May 2008 08:53:54 +1000, dorayme
> <doraymeRidThis@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
>>In article <piiq141v482e34vauqbf89btkqb91qvf0i@4ax.com>,
>> Mason C <masoncXXX@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote:

> The question was:
>
> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox. Why?
>
> I'm beginning to suspect I'm asking in the wrong group.

The background colours are identical in Opera, Firefox, IE6, IE7, Seamonky
and FWIW Netsacpe and IE5.5. They are a blue background, a table with a
white cell, a pink one, a blueish white one, a plale blue one and a darker
pale blue one. The sole exception is that the empty white cell collapses in
IE browsers.

I'm beginning to suspect that you are not reading the replies to your
posts.

--
Richard
Killing all google groups posts
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org

On Mon, 05 May 2008 05:34:20 GMT, rf <rf@x.invalid> wrote:

>Mason C <masoncXXX@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote in
>news:t66t14d69q1us7k3g3t4obec7d49f5fe0q@4ax.com :
>
>> On Mon, 05 May 2008 08:53:54 +1000, dorayme
>> <doraymeRidThis@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>>
>>>In article <piiq141v482e34vauqbf89btkqb91qvf0i@4ax.com>,
>>> Mason C <masoncXXX@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote:
>
>> The question was:
>>
>> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox. Why?
>>
>> I'm beginning to suspect I'm asking in the wrong group.
>
>The background colours are identical in Opera, Firefox, IE6, IE7, Seamonky
>and FWIW Netsacpe and IE5.5. They are a blue background, a table with a
>white cell, a pink one, a blueish white one, a plale blue one and a darker
>pale blue one. The sole exception is that the empty white cell collapses in
>IE browsers.
>
>I'm beginning to suspect that you are not reading the replies to your
>posts.

What am I not reading? But thanks for your observations.
Let me add more tests on my PC computer:

Safari (PC) displays the colors.
Opera ok
Netscape Communicator displays correctly except the "white" bar at the
top shows body color.

MS IE 6 and 7 show no colors and top white cell is missing
Firefox shows no colors.

The page passes WDG validation. Why does my computer do this
on Firefox and IE 6 and 7 (freshly installed 7) ? (Popular browsers.)

What am I not reading? Am I missing some replies?

I have 2 from Jukka
1 from Neil
1 from dorayme
1from rf

I'm sensing anger and annoyance from what seems to me
a simple question. I suspect the answer is *not* simple and
probably needs response from a browser program expert, not an
html expert. I'll seek elsewhere.

( I also suspect that WDG validation is of doubtful significance.)

Anyway, thanks for your time if not your tender loving care.

Mason C

On May 5, 4:20 pm, Mason C <masonc...@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote:
> On Mon, 05 May 2008 05:34:20 GMT, rf <r...@x.invalid> wrote:
> >Mason C <masonc...@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote in
> >news:t66t14d69q1us7k3g3t4obec7d49f5fe0q@4ax.com :
>
> >> On Mon, 05 May 2008 08:53:54 +1000, dorayme
> >> <doraymeRidT...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> >>>In article <piiq141v482e34vauqbf89btkqb91qv...@4ax.com>,
> >>> Mason C <masonc...@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote:
>
> >> The question was:
>
> >> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox. Why?
>
> >> I'm beginning to suspect I'm asking in the wrong group.
>
> >The background colours are identical in Opera, Firefox, IE6, IE7, Seamonky
> >and FWIW Netsacpe and IE5.5. They are a blue background, a table with a
> >white cell, a pink one, a blueish white one, a plale blue one and a darker
> >pale blue one. The sole exception is that the empty white cell collapses in
> >IE browsers.
>
> >I'm beginning to suspect that you are not reading the replies to your
> >posts.
>
> What am I not reading? But thanks for your observations.
> Let me add more tests on my PC computer:
>
> Safari (PC) displays the colors.
> Opera ok
> Netscape Communicator displays correctly except the "white" bar at the
> top shows body color.
>
> MS IE 6 and 7 show no colors and top white cell is missing
> Firefox shows no colors.
>
> The page passes WDG validation. Why does my computer do this
> on Firefox and IE 6 and 7 (freshly installed 7) ? (Popular browsers.)
>
> What am I not reading? Am I missing some replies?
>
> I have 2 from Jukka
> 1 from Neil
> 1 from dorayme
> 1from rf
>
> I'm sensing anger and annoyance from what seems to me
> a simple question. I suspect the answer is *not* simple and
> probably needs response from a browser program expert, not an
> html expert. I'll seek elsewhere.
>
> ( I also suspect that WDG validation is of doubtful significance.)
>
> Anyway, thanks for your time if not your tender loving care.
>
> Mason C

As far as I can see, you were advised to put in a &nbsp; into the
empty cell (by Jukka Korpela) to stop the collapse mentioned clearly
by rf. If this is not what is wanted why don't you say something about
it and something very specific?

On Sun, 4 May 2008 23:41:11 -0700 (PDT), Patricia Aldoraz
<patricia.aldoraz@gmail.com> wrote:

>On May 5, 4:20 pm, Mason C <masonc...@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote:
>> On Mon, 05 May 2008 05:34:20 GMT, rf <r...@x.invalid> wrote:
>> >Mason C <masonc...@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote in
>> >news:t66t14d69q1us7k3g3t4obec7d49f5fe0q@4ax.com :
>>
>> >> On Mon, 05 May 2008 08:53:54 +1000, dorayme
>> >> <doraymeRidT...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>>
>> >>>In article <piiq141v482e34vauqbf89btkqb91qv...@4ax.com>,
>> >>> Mason C <masonc...@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote:
>>
>> >> The question was:
>>
>> >> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox. Why?
>>
>> >> I'm beginning to suspect I'm asking in the wrong group.
>>
>> >The background colours are identical in Opera, Firefox, IE6, IE7, Seamonky
>> >and FWIW Netsacpe and IE5.5. They are a blue background, a table with a
>> >white cell, a pink one, a blueish white one, a plale blue one and a darker
>> >pale blue one. The sole exception is that the empty white cell collapses in
>> >IE browsers.
>>
>> >I'm beginning to suspect that you are not reading the replies to your
>> >posts.
>>
>> What am I not reading? But thanks for your observations.
>> Let me add more tests on my PC computer:
>>
>> Safari (PC) displays the colors.
>> Opera ok
>> Netscape Communicator displays correctly except the "white" bar at the
>> top shows body color.
>>
>> MS IE 6 and 7 show no colors and top white cell is missing
>> Firefox shows no colors.
>>
>> The page passes WDG validation. Why does my computer do this
>> on Firefox and IE 6 and 7 (freshly installed 7) ? (Popular browsers.)
>>
>> What am I not reading? Am I missing some replies?
>>
>> I have 2 from Jukka
>> 1 from Neil
>> 1 from dorayme
>> 1from rf
>>
>> I'm sensing anger and annoyance from what seems to me
>> a simple question. I suspect the answer is *not* simple and
>> probably needs response from a browser program expert, not an
>> html expert. I'll seek elsewhere.
>>
>> ( I also suspect that WDG validation is of doubtful significance.)
>>
>> Anyway, thanks for your time if not your tender loving care.
>>
>> Mason C
>
>As far as I can see, you were advised to put in a &nbsp; into the
>empty cell (by Jukka Korpela) to stop the collapse mentioned clearly
>by rf. If this is not what is wanted why don't you say something about
>it and something very specific?

Oh, for God's sake. Yes, I needed something, an &nbsp; in the top cell.

That has NOTHING to do with my question.

It is incomprehensible to me why this question cannot be understood.
I am now certain I'm posting it in the wrong group.

On my computer:
My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.

On my computer:
My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.

On my computer:
My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.

Screw anything else wrong with the page. (*%$^&@Q&^(*

Mason C

Mon, 05 May 2008 00:07:17 -0700, /Mason C/:

> On my computer:
> My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
> On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.

Oh, man. I got sick of reading over and over people telling you
they see the colors all right in IE 6 and Firefox on their computers
- just check your configuration. Do you observe the "missing"
colors only on that page of yours using those browsers? Have you by
accident played with those browsers' accessibility features
regarding colors? Check these options:

IE 6:
Tools -> Internet Options... General: Accessibility...
[ ] Ignore colors specified on Web pages

Firefox:
Tools -> Options... Content: Colors...
[x] Allow pages to choose their own colors, instead of my selections
above

--
Stanimir

Mason C <masoncXXX@XXXfrontal-lobe.info> wrote in
news:f4ct14h0f0utrujqgv7ljku0lqg9rbf15o@4ax.com:

> Oh, for God's sake. Yes, I needed something, an &nbsp; in the top
> cell.
>
> That has NOTHING to do with my question.
>
> It is incomprehensible to me why this question cannot be understood.
> I am now certain I'm posting it in the wrong group.

Nope. Just with the wrong mindset.

> On my computer:
> My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
> On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.
>
> On my computer:
> My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
> On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.
>
> On my computer:
> My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
> On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.

*On my computer*.

Mason, so far this thread has been: You see something wrong. The rest of
the world does *not* see something wrong.

To be completely specific, we do not actually *SEE* what you think is
wrong with the page.

Why don't you do something totally radical and provide us with a
screenshot of *your* computer doing these things, aledgedly, wrong?

As somebody else said: Check your settings. Show us a screenshot of the
dialog box where you have *not* told IE to ignore background colours set
by web authors.

So far none of us has jack shit to go on.

> Screw anything else wrong with the page. (*%$^&@Q&^(*

To be very polite, it's getting very near the time when I, at least, will
say: Screw you.

--
Richard
Killing all google groups posts
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org

>>
>> On my computer:
>> My page has *bgcolors* in the body and in the <td> cells.
>> On MS IE 6 and 7 colors are not displayed.
>
>*On my computer*.
>
>Mason, so far this thread has been: You see something wrong. The rest of
>the world does *not* see something wrong.
>
>To be completely specific, we do not actually *SEE* what you think is
>wrong with the page.

I have now by mystic mind reading gathered that and realize that the
problem is not in the pages. After so many digressive and abusive
responses.

>
>Why don't you do something totally radical and provide us with a
>screenshot of *your* computer doing these things, aledgedly, wrong?
>
>As somebody else said: Check your settings. Show us a screenshot of the
>dialog box where you have *not* told IE to ignore background colours set
>by web authors.
>
>So far none of us has jack shit to go on.
>
>> Screw anything else wrong with the page. (*%$^&@Q&^(*
>
>To be very polite, it's getting very near the time when I, at least, will
>say: Screw you.

I did it first. Ya Ya Ya

Well, now we're getting somewhere. Too bad it took so long.

It is certainly something in my computer, not the web pages.

First, please just believe me when I say "no bg colors" -- that
means *no bg colors* that means a white screen with text.
A "picture" shouldn't be necessary if people had read what I posted..

Yes, first thing I checked was accessibility settings for author colors.
But that is the first good suggestion I've seen here.

My post is in the wrong group. I have now posted in the browser group.

Bye bye you nice people.

Mason C

Mason C wrote:
> The question was:
>
> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox. Why?
>
> I'm beginning to suspect I'm asking in the wrong group.

Well, since you won't tell us which colours don't show for you I decided
to try guessing. The page appears essentially the same for me in Opera,
Firefox, IE6, Safari and IE8 (Beta). If you see a significant difference
you should go see an optician. They'll have a sign in the window saying
"If you can't see what you want, you've come to the right place".

The only difference is that IE6 and IE8 chose to show no row at all
where you had no content. That's reasonable. If you want to force the
"white" row at the top in IE, then add at least <BR> or &nbsp; to your cell.

--
Steve Swift
http://www.swiftys.org.uk/swifty.html
http://www.ringers.org.uk

On Mon, 05 May 2008 19:25:55 +0100, Steve Swift <Steve.J.Swift@gmail.com> wrote:

>Mason C wrote:
>> The question was:
>>
>> The colors show ok in Opera but not in MSIE or Firefox. Why?
>>
>> I'm beginning to suspect I'm asking in the wrong group.
>
>Well, since you won't tell us which colours don't show for you

I assumed that an "authoring.html" group would know what was meant
by "bgcolor" and by "no color" and by "white"

But I've found the problem and will post it here and now....

> I decided
>to try guessing. The page appears essentially the same for me in Opera,
>Firefox, IE6, Safari and IE8 (Beta). If you see a significant difference
>you should go see an optician. They'll have a sign in the window saying
>"If you can't see what you want, you've come to the right place".
>
>The only difference is that IE6 and IE8 chose to show no row at all
>where you had no content. That's reasonable. If you want to force the
>"white" row at the top in IE, then add at least <BR> or &nbsp; to your cell.

OK, it's time to call everyone together and reveal that the butler did it.

In Windows XP: Control Panel -- Accessibility Options -- [X] Use High Contrast

It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it.

I *always* use a good browser, Opera, which ignores that WinXP option.

Only when I tested on my computer with other browsers did I have
the problem.

The browsers and html were not guilty. The butler did it.

I'm sorry if this detective story wasn't fun for you. Nor for me.

Mason C

P.S. I only found it because my new printer talked Turkish to me and
I had to go find the Turk in my Control Panel and stumbled on the culprit.

Mason C wrote:

> I assumed that an "authoring.html" group would know what was meant by
> "bgcolor" and by "no color" and by "white"

Of course we do. Do note that, even when asked several times, you never
posted a screenshot to show everyone what you saw, and what everyone
else did *not* see.

> It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it.

We? How many of us were sitting around your computer looking over your
shoulder? <lol>

--
-bts
-Friends don't let friends drive Windows

Mason C wrote:
> OK, it's time to call everyone together and reveal that the butler did it.
>
> In Windows XP: Control Panel -- Accessibility Options -- [X] Use High Contrast
>
> It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it.
>
> I *always* use a good browser, Opera, which ignores that WinXP option.
>
> Only when I tested on my computer with other browsers did I have
> the problem.
>
> The browsers and html were not guilty. The butler did it.
>
> I'm sorry if this detective story wasn't fun for you. Nor for me.
>
> Mason C
>
> P.S. I only found it because my new printer talked Turkish to me and
> I had to go find the Turk in my Control Panel and stumbled on the culprit.

Be careful before you trash folk who were honestly trying to . BTW
"bgcolor" is so last millennium! Time to update your skill a bit. Try
tutorials at www.htmldog.com

Before I saw this post I was taking pity on your sorry markup, and made
a more modern template for you. Don't care for your color and design
choices here here it goes.

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd">
<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta http-equiv="content-language" content="en-us">

<title>Welcome to the 21st century</title>

<style type="text/css">
body { color: #fff; background: #00c; }
a { color: #fff; }
.wrapper { margin: 2em auto; padding: 2px; border: 1px outset #00c;
width: 80%; }
.panel1, .panel2, .panel3, .panel4 { padding: 1em; border: 1px
inset #00c; color: #000; }
.panel1 a { color: #900; }
.panel1 { background: #fcc; text-align: center; }
.panel2 { background: #eef; }
.panel3 { background: #ddf; }
.panel4 { background: #ccf; text-align: center; }
.panel2 a, .panel3 a, .panel4 a { color: #00c; }
.bottomlink { text-align: center; }
</style>

</head>
<body>
</body>
<div class="wrapper">
<div class="panel1">
<h1>
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O"
height="11" width="10">
<a href="http://frontal-lobe.info/greateramerica.pdf#page=7">
Greater America in the Age of Rebellion
</a>
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O"
height="11" width="10">
</h1>
Panel 1 contents
</div>
<div class="panel2">
Panel 2 contents
</div>
<div class="panel3">
Panel 3 contents
</div>
<div class="panel4">
Panel 4 contents
</div>
</div>
<div class="bottomlink">
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11"
width="10">
<a href="http://frontal-lobe.info/">Home</a>
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11"
width="10">
</div>

</html>




--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4art@central.net>
wrote:

I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post.

I asked a simple question. Later realized that the nature of the problem
belonged in a browser group, not in an html group. My error. It turned
out to belong in a Windows XP group -- I never imagined that.

I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about
my example page that had *nothing* to do with the question.

The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood.
I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of *no color* ?

All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration
of a modern code for the example page.

Believe it or not I do know something about css and use a .css file on my
web site. Most of the site long predates css and even has some ascii graphics
to conserve download time (!) I do not have time to translate all of it to
this century.

I will be updating and burying much of it if time permits.

I hope never again to have a *simple* question.

Let all my problems be BIG problems.

Thanks you all and bye bye.

Mason C

no color no color no color sheeeeez !

Scripsit Mason C:

> On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
> <lws4art@central.net> wrote:
>
> I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post.

That's a foolish quotation - an attribution of nothing. If you don't
like to play by Usenet rules, please go away.

> I asked a simple question.

In the most confusing way.

> I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about
> my example page that had *nothing* to do with the question.

Get real. This is a discussion forum, not a desk. You post
something, we discuss its implications. If it happens to answer a
question you asked or you had in your mind, that's coincidental.

Besides, the page you posted needs a rewrite, not fixing, especially
since the thing you saw as a problem was just a browser configuration
problem (as you would have learned very fast if you had described the
problem properly).

> The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood.
> I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of *no
> color* ?

No, just a URL of such an image. You did not actually see "no color",
any more than you can see the air as such. You probably saw white or
some shade of gray; they're colors. But this was just a tiny part of the
confusion you created.

> All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration
> of a modern code for the example page.

Well, it was wrong in a couple of ways, and off-topic (CSS, not HTML),
so you had better start from a modern book on web authoring.

> I hope never again to have a *simple* question.

There are no simple questions.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

Mon, 05 May 2008 12:24:31 -0700, /Mason C/:

> OK, it's time to call everyone together and reveal that the butler did it.
>
> In Windows XP: Control Panel -- Accessibility Options -- [X] Use High Contrast
>
> It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it.
>
> I *always* use a good browser, Opera, which ignores that WinXP option.

How does not supporting/honoring certain OS feature makes Opera a
better browser? If you say Safari is better in the same regard - I
dislike pretty much the inability to set preferred languages when
requesting pages (the Accept-Language header) in Safari on Windows.
I've read Safari on Mac uses the system user preferences for this
purpose but on Windows it always defaults to English (as far as I've
observed).

--
Stanimir

On Tue, 6 May 2008 10:47:59 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi>
wrote:

>Scripsit Mason C:
>
>> On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
>> <lws4art@central.net> wrote:
>>
>> I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post.
>
>That's a foolish quotation - an attribution of nothing. If you don't
>like to play by Usenet rules, please go away.
>
>> I asked a simple question.
>
>In the most confusing way.
>
>> I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about
>> my example page that had *nothing* to do with the question.
>
>Get real. This is a discussion forum, not a desk. You post
>something, we discuss its implications. If it happens to answer a
>question you asked or you had in your mind, that's coincidental.
>
>Besides, the page you posted needs a rewrite, not fixing, especially
>since the thing you saw as a problem was just a browser configuration
>problem (as you would have learned very fast if you had described the
>problem properly).

I don't won't to leave an error here. It was *not* a browser configuration
problem. It was a Windows XP configuration problem. I had at some
time long ago set XP (not a browser) accessibility to high contrast.

It was not an html problem. It was not a browser problem. However,
the differing reactions among the browsers caused confusion.

Standards, where are they?

bye bye

Mason C



>
>> The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood.
>> I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of *no
>> color* ?
>
>No, just a URL of such an image. You did not actually see "no color",
>any more than you can see the air as such. You probably saw white or
>some shade of gray; they're colors. But this was just a tiny part of the
>confusion you created.
>
>> All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration
>> of a modern code for the example page.
>
>Well, it was wrong in a couple of ways, and off-topic (CSS, not HTML),
>so you had better start from a modern book on web authoring.
>
>> I hope never again to have a *simple* question.
>
>There are no simple questions.

Scripsit Mason C:

[ a fullquote, often a useful indication of cluelessness, arrogance, or
sloppiness ]

> I don't won't to leave an error here. It was *not* a browser
> configuration problem.

Whatever. What you regard as "browser configuration" is quite irrelevant
to HTML authoring for the WWW.

Thank you for making it so clear that at least by now, everyone should
killfile you to avoid seeing any more pointless babbling from you. Thank
you indeed. Please do not change your forged From field before you have
a clue. Thank you in advance.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

On Tue, 6 May 2008 14:31:56 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi>
wrote:

>Scripsit Mason C:
>
>[ a fullquote, often a useful indication of cluelessness, arrogance, or
>sloppiness ]
>
>> I don't won't to leave an error here. It was *not* a browser
>> configuration problem.
>
>Whatever. What you regard as "browser configuration" is quite irrelevant
>to HTML authoring for the WWW.
>
>Thank you for making it so clear that at least by now, everyone should
>killfile you to avoid seeing any more pointless babbling from you. Thank
>you indeed. Please do not change your forged From field before you have
>a clue. Thank you in advance.

"Forged From Field" ? Am I supposed to shut up and go away after
such a remark? "foreged"? Anti-spammed, yes. But "forged"?

The spirit of this group amazes me. Anger. Attacking trivia.
What's going on? This would be a place for a psychologist to study.

The unexpected intrusion of Windows XP into the appearance of
a web site is worth knowing about. Now you know.

And, obviously, it *was* unexpected or someone would have warned
me about it as a cause of my problem.

Have *fun* kids,

Mason C