BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) - Page 3

05/05/2008, 21h08

Mason C wrote:

> I assumed that an "authoring.html" group would know what was meant by
> "bgcolor" and by "no color" and by "white"

Of course we do. Do note that, even when asked several times, you never
posted a screenshot to show everyone what you saw, and what everyone
else did *not* see.

> It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it.

We? How many of us were sitting around your computer looking over your
shoulder? <lol>

--
-bts
-Friends don't let friends drive Windows

05/05/2008, 23h55

Mason C wrote:
> OK, it's time to call everyone together and reveal that the butler did it.
>
> In Windows XP: Control Panel -- Accessibility Options -- [X] Use High Contrast
>
> It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it.
>
> I *always* use a good browser, Opera, which ignores that WinXP option.
>
> Only when I tested on my computer with other browsers did I have
> the problem.
>
> The browsers and html were not guilty. The butler did it.
>
> I'm sorry if this detective story wasn't fun for you. Nor for me.
>
> Mason C
>
> P.S. I only found it because my new printer talked Turkish to me and
> I had to go find the Turk in my Control Panel and stumbled on the culprit.

Be careful before you trash folk who were honestly trying to . BTW
"bgcolor" is so last millennium! Time to update your skill a bit. Try
tutorials at www.htmldog.com

Before I saw this post I was taking pity on your sorry markup, and made
a more modern template for you. Don't care for your color and design
choices here here it goes.

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd">
<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta http-equiv="content-language" content="en-us">

<title>Welcome to the 21st century</title>

<style type="text/css">
body { color: #fff; background: #00c; }
a { color: #fff; }
.wrapper { margin: 2em auto; padding: 2px; border: 1px outset #00c;
width: 80%; }
.panel1, .panel2, .panel3, .panel4 { padding: 1em; border: 1px
inset #00c; color: #000; }
.panel1 a { color: #900; }
.panel1 { background: #fcc; text-align: center; }
.panel2 { background: #eef; }
.panel3 { background: #ddf; }
.panel4 { background: #ccf; text-align: center; }
.panel2 a, .panel3 a, .panel4 a { color: #00c; }
.bottomlink { text-align: center; }
</style>

</head>
<body>
</body>
<div class="wrapper">
<div class="panel1">
<h1>
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O"
height="11" width="10">
<a href="http://frontal-lobe.info/greateramerica.pdf#page=7">
Greater America in the Age of Rebellion
</a>
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O"
height="11" width="10">
</h1>
Panel 1 contents
</div>
<div class="panel2">
Panel 2 contents
</div>
<div class="panel3">
Panel 3 contents
</div>
<div class="panel4">
Panel 4 contents
</div>
</div>
<div class="bottomlink">
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11"
width="10">
<a href="http://frontal-lobe.info/">Home</a>
<img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11"
width="10">
</div>

</html>

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

06/05/2008, 01h23

On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4art@central.net>
wrote:

I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post.

I asked a simple question. Later realized that the nature of the problem
belonged in a browser group, not in an html group. My error. It turned
out to belong in a Windows XP group -- I never imagined that.

I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about
my example page that had *nothing* to do with the question.

The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood.
I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of *no color* ?

All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration
of a modern code for the example page.

Believe it or not I do know something about css and use a .css file on my
web site. Most of the site long predates css and even has some ascii graphics
to conserve download time (!) I do not have time to translate all of it to
this century.

I will be updating and burying much of it if time permits.

I hope never again to have a *simple* question.

Let all my problems be BIG problems.

Thanks you all and bye bye.

Mason C

no color no color no color sheeeeez !

06/05/2008, 08h47

Scripsit Mason C:

> On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
> <lws4art@central.net> wrote:
>
> I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post.

That's a foolish quotation - an attribution of nothing. If you don't
like to play by Usenet rules, please go away.

> I asked a simple question.

In the most confusing way.

> I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about
> my example page that had *nothing* to do with the question.

Get real. This is a discussion forum, not a desk. You post
something, we discuss its implications. If it happens to answer a
question you asked or you had in your mind, that's coincidental.

Besides, the page you posted needs a rewrite, not fixing, especially
since the thing you saw as a problem was just a browser configuration
problem (as you would have learned very fast if you had described the
problem properly).

> The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood.
> I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of *no
> color* ?

No, just a URL of such an image. You did not actually see "no color",
any more than you can see the air as such. You probably saw white or
some shade of gray; they're colors. But this was just a tiny part of the
confusion you created.

> All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration
> of a modern code for the example page.

Well, it was wrong in a couple of ways, and off-topic (CSS, not HTML),
so you had better start from a modern book on web authoring.

> I hope never again to have a *simple* question.

There are no simple questions.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

06/05/2008, 09h25

Mon, 05 May 2008 12:24:31 -0700, /Mason C/:

> OK, it's time to call everyone together and reveal that the butler did it.
>
> In Windows XP: Control Panel -- Accessibility Options -- [X] Use High Contrast
>
> It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it.
>
> I *always* use a good browser, Opera, which ignores that WinXP option.

How does not supporting/honoring certain OS feature makes Opera a
better browser? If you say Safari is better in the same regard - I
dislike pretty much the inability to set preferred languages when
requesting pages (the Accept-Language header) in Safari on Windows.
I've read Safari on Mac uses the system user preferences for this
purpose but on Windows it always defaults to English (as far as I've
observed).

--
Stanimir

06/05/2008, 10h26

On Tue, 6 May 2008 10:47:59 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi>
wrote:

>Scripsit Mason C:
>
>> On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
>> <lws4art@central.net> wrote:
>>
>> I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post.
>
>That's a foolish quotation - an attribution of nothing. If you don't
>like to play by Usenet rules, please go away.
>
>> I asked a simple question.
>
>In the most confusing way.
>
>> I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about
>> my example page that had *nothing* to do with the question.
>
>Get real. This is a discussion forum, not a desk. You post
>something, we discuss its implications. If it happens to answer a
>question you asked or you had in your mind, that's coincidental.
>
>Besides, the page you posted needs a rewrite, not fixing, especially
>since the thing you saw as a problem was just a browser configuration
>problem (as you would have learned very fast if you had described the
>problem properly).

I don't won't to leave an error here. It was *not* a browser configuration
problem. It was a Windows XP configuration problem. I had at some
time long ago set XP (not a browser) accessibility to high contrast.

It was not an html problem. It was not a browser problem. However,
the differing reactions among the browsers caused confusion.

Standards, where are they?

bye bye

Mason C

>
>> The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood.
>> I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of *no
>> color* ?
>
>No, just a URL of such an image. You did not actually see "no color",
>any more than you can see the air as such. You probably saw white or
>some shade of gray; they're colors. But this was just a tiny part of the
>confusion you created.
>
>> All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration
>> of a modern code for the example page.
>
>Well, it was wrong in a couple of ways, and off-topic (CSS, not HTML),
>so you had better start from a modern book on web authoring.
>
>> I hope never again to have a *simple* question.
>
>There are no simple questions.

06/05/2008, 12h31

Scripsit Mason C:

[ a fullquote, often a useful indication of cluelessness, arrogance, or
sloppiness ]

> I don't won't to leave an error here. It was *not* a browser
> configuration problem.

Whatever. What you regard as "browser configuration" is quite irrelevant
to HTML authoring for the WWW.

Thank you for making it so clear that at least by now, everyone should
killfile you to avoid seeing any more pointless babbling from you. Thank
you indeed. Please do not change your forged From field before you have
a clue. Thank you in advance.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

06/05/2008, 20h07

On Tue, 6 May 2008 14:31:56 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi>
wrote:

>Scripsit Mason C:
>
>[ a fullquote, often a useful indication of cluelessness, arrogance, or
>sloppiness ]
>
>> I don't won't to leave an error here. It was *not* a browser
>> configuration problem.
>
>Whatever. What you regard as "browser configuration" is quite irrelevant
>to HTML authoring for the WWW.
>
>Thank you for making it so clear that at least by now, everyone should
>killfile you to avoid seeing any more pointless babbling from you. Thank
>you indeed. Please do not change your forged From field before you have
>a clue. Thank you in advance.

"Forged From Field" ? Am I supposed to shut up and go away after
such a remark? "foreged"? Anti-spammed, yes. But "forged"?

The spirit of this group amazes me. Anger. Attacking trivia.
What's going on? This would be a place for a psychologist to study.

The unexpected intrusion of Windows XP into the appearance of
a web site is worth knowing about. Now you know.

And, obviously, it *was* unexpected or someone would have warned
me about it as a cause of my problem.

Have *fun* kids,

Mason C

05/05/2008, 21h08	#17
Beauregard T. Shagnasty Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) Mason C wrote: > I assumed that an "authoring.html" group would know what was meant by > "bgcolor" and by "no color" and by "white" Of course we do. Do note that, even when asked several times, you never posted a screenshot to show everyone what you saw, and what everyone else did not see. > It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it. We? How many of us were sitting around your computer looking over your shoulder? <lol> -- -bts -Friends don't let friends drive Windows

05/05/2008, 23h55	#18
Jonathan N. Little Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) Mason C wrote: > OK, it's time to call everyone together and reveal that the butler did it. > > In Windows XP: Control Panel -- Accessibility Options -- [X] Use High Contrast > > It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it. > > I always use a good browser, Opera, which ignores that WinXP option. > > Only when I tested on my computer with other browsers did I have > the problem. > > The browsers and html were not guilty. The butler did it. > > I'm sorry if this detective story wasn't fun for you. Nor for me. > > Mason C > > P.S. I only found it because my new printer talked Turkish to me and > I had to go find the Turk in my Control Panel and stumbled on the culprit. Be careful before you trash folk who were honestly trying to . BTW "bgcolor" is so last millennium! Time to update your skill a bit. Try tutorials at www.htmldog.com Before I saw this post I was taking pity on your sorry markup, and made a more modern template for you. Don't care for your color and design choices here here it goes. <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd"> <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"> <meta http-equiv="content-language" content="en-us"> <title>Welcome to the 21st century</title> <style type="text/css"> body { color: #fff; background: #00c; } a { color: #fff; } .wrapper { margin: 2em auto; padding: 2px; border: 1px outset #00c; width: 80%; } .panel1, .panel2, .panel3, .panel4 { padding: 1em; border: 1px inset #00c; color: #000; } .panel1 a { color: #900; } .panel1 { background: #fcc; text-align: center; } .panel2 { background: #eef; } .panel3 { background: #ddf; } .panel4 { background: #ccf; text-align: center; } .panel2 a, .panel3 a, .panel4 a { color: #00c; } .bottomlink { text-align: center; } </style> </head> <body> </body> <div class="wrapper"> <div class="panel1"> <h1> <img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11" width="10"> <a href="http://frontal-lobe.info/greateramerica.pdf#page=7"> Greater America in the Age of Rebellion </a> <img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11" width="10"> </h1> Panel 1 contents </div> <div class="panel2"> Panel 2 contents </div> <div class="panel3"> Panel 3 contents </div> <div class="panel4"> Panel 4 contents </div> </div> <div class="bottomlink"> <img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11" width="10"> <a href="http://frontal-lobe.info/">Home</a> <img src="http://frontal-lobe.info/grnballs.gif" alt="O" height="11" width="10"> </div> </html> -- Take care, Jonathan ------------------- LITTLE WORKS STUDIO http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

06/05/2008, 01h23	#19
Mason C Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4art@central.net> wrote: I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post. I asked a simple question. Later realized that the nature of the problem belonged in a browser group, not in an html group. My error. It turned out to belong in a Windows XP group -- I never imagined that. I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about my example page that had nothing to do with the question. The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood. I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of no color ? All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration of a modern code for the example page. Believe it or not I do know something about css and use a .css file on my web site. Most of the site long predates css and even has some ascii graphics to conserve download time (!) I do not have time to translate all of it to this century. I will be updating and burying much of it if time permits. I hope never again to have a simple question. Let all my problems be BIG problems. Thanks you all and bye bye. Mason C no color no color no color sheeeeez !

06/05/2008, 08h47	#20
Jukka K. Korpela Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) Scripsit Mason C: > On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little" > <lws4art@central.net> wrote: > > I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post. That's a foolish quotation - an attribution of nothing. If you don't like to play by Usenet rules, please go away. > I asked a simple question. In the most confusing way. > I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about > my example page that had nothing to do with the question. Get real. This is a discussion forum, not a desk. You post something, we discuss its implications. If it happens to answer a question you asked or you had in your mind, that's coincidental. Besides, the page you posted needs a rewrite, not fixing, especially since the thing you saw as a problem was just a browser configuration problem (as you would have learned very fast if you had described the problem properly). > The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood. > I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of no > color ? No, just a URL of such an image. You did not actually see "no color", any more than you can see the air as such. You probably saw white or some shade of gray; they're colors. But this was just a tiny part of the confusion you created. > All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration > of a modern code for the example page. Well, it was wrong in a couple of ways, and off-topic (CSS, not HTML), so you had better start from a modern book on web authoring. > I hope never again to have a simple question. There are no simple questions. -- Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca") http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

06/05/2008, 09h25	#21
Stanimir Stamenkov Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) Mon, 05 May 2008 12:24:31 -0700, /Mason C/: > OK, it's time to call everyone together and reveal that the butler did it. > > In Windows XP: Control Panel -- Accessibility Options -- [X] Use High Contrast > > It was checked in Chapter One, long ago, and we all missed it. > > I always use a good browser, Opera, which ignores that WinXP option. How does not supporting/honoring certain OS feature makes Opera a better browser? If you say Safari is better in the same regard - I dislike pretty much the inability to set preferred languages when requesting pages (the Accept-Language header) in Safari on Windows. I've read Safari on Mac uses the system user preferences for this purpose but on Windows it always defaults to English (as far as I've observed). -- Stanimir

06/05/2008, 10h26	#22
Mason C Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) On Tue, 6 May 2008 10:47:59 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> wrote: >Scripsit Mason C: > >> On Mon, 05 May 2008 18:55:38 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little" >> <lws4art@central.net> wrote: >> >> I'll snip the long post -- it can be read in the original post. > >That's a foolish quotation - an attribution of nothing. If you don't >like to play by Usenet rules, please go away. > >> I asked a simple question. > >In the most confusing way. > >> I asked a simple question and got all sorts of abuse for things about >> my example page that had nothing to do with the question. > >Get real. This is a discussion forum, not a desk. You post >something, we discuss its implications. If it happens to answer a >question you asked or you had in your mind, that's coincidental. > >Besides, the page you posted needs a rewrite, not fixing, especially >since the thing you saw as a problem was just a browser configuration >problem (as you would have learned very fast if you had described the >problem properly). I don't won't to leave an error here. It was not a browser configuration problem. It was a Windows XP configuration problem. I had at some time long ago set XP (not a browser) accessibility to high contrast. It was not an html problem. It was not a browser problem. However, the differing reactions among the browsers caused confusion. Standards, where are they? bye bye Mason C > >> The simple "no color" statement seemed never to be understood. >> I am at a loss to understand this. I should post a picture of no >> color ? > >No, just a URL of such an image. You did not actually see "no color", >any more than you can see the air as such. You probably saw white or >some shade of gray; they're colors. But this was just a tiny part of the >confusion you created. > >> All that said, I do appreciate Jonathan's demonstration >> of a modern code for the example page. > >Well, it was wrong in a couple of ways, and off-topic (CSS, not HTML), >so you had better start from a modern book on web authoring. > >> I hope never again to have a simple question. > >There are no simple questions.

06/05/2008, 12h31	#23
Jukka K. Korpela Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) Scripsit Mason C: [ a fullquote, often a useful indication of cluelessness, arrogance, or sloppiness ] > I don't won't to leave an error here. It was not a browser > configuration problem. Whatever. What you regard as "browser configuration" is quite irrelevant to HTML authoring for the WWW. Thank you for making it so clear that at least by now, everyone should killfile you to avoid seeing any more pointless babbling from you. Thank you indeed. Please do not change your forged From field before you have a clue. Thank you in advance. -- Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca") http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

06/05/2008, 20h07	#24
Mason C Messages: n/a Hébergeur:	Re: BGCOLOR only in Opera, not other browsers (valid page) On Tue, 6 May 2008 14:31:56 +0300, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> wrote: >Scripsit Mason C: > >[ a fullquote, often a useful indication of cluelessness, arrogance, or >sloppiness ] > >> I don't won't to leave an error here. It was not a browser >> configuration problem. > >Whatever. What you regard as "browser configuration" is quite irrelevant >to HTML authoring for the WWW. > >Thank you for making it so clear that at least by now, everyone should >killfile you to avoid seeing any more pointless babbling from you. Thank >you indeed. Please do not change your forged From field before you have >a clue. Thank you in advance. "Forged From Field" ? Am I supposed to shut up and go away after such a remark? "foreged"? Anti-spammed, yes. But "forged"? The spirit of this group amazes me. Anger. Attacking trivia. What's going on? This would be a place for a psychologist to study. The unexpected intrusion of Windows XP into the appearance of a web site is worth knowing about. Now you know. And, obviously, it was unexpected or someone would have warned me about it as a cause of my problem. Have fun kids, Mason C

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